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+--- Thread: Add WSS to Bee wing! (/showthread.php?tid=22770)
RE: Add WSS to Bee wing! - Gojira - 12-29-2012
Your keyboards aren't lightsabers bros...
RE: Add WSS to Bee wing! - Merellis - 12-29-2012
I've fallen into this mentality.
![[Image: duty_calls.png]](http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/duty_calls.png)
RE: Add WSS to Bee wing! - Aaronock - 12-29-2012
Well all I gotta ask is, where are these supposed carebears at currently, and why have they not told us to just hug and be nice to one another?
RE:??Add WSS to Bee wing! - ChaosPrince - 12-29-2012
Gojira Wrote:Your keyboards aren't lightsabers bros...
Lol, lucky I'm not a teacher, won't need to correct essays
RE: Add WSS to Bee wing! - Seth~ - 12-29-2012
@Merellis I believe I am getting to understand the basis behind your argument.
You basically want to dramatically alter the item drop list and formula to make it more fair, to justify the exclusion of wss. This is while you wish items like karvo to remain.
I wonder if I should have numbered points listed.
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In the first response to a point made you
Merellis Wrote:Okay lets say they're added to Bee Wings.thus you agree with me on leaving wss out of bw is unfair since it is used much more in comparison to other skills. You then go on about the dropping formula that should be used in bee wings, you made a point about not using bw effectively. So you basically argue that we all should forget about items that we want and farm items like karvo.
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Merellis Wrote:You're warping that much and land on another Warp Portal that kicks you out? Hilarious!You basically say that wss should be kept out & all the items that drop at 100% (which are easier to farm in comparison) must be removed.
As for the item that gets you into the Underground? Heaven forbid that you have to go kill a couple Clock Tower Managers or Elders.
There's walking involved in a dungeon? THE HORROR THE HORROR! D:
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You later go on saying that you want to dramatically alter bw since you can farm those items from monsters at 100%. Ok to rephrase you agree with me the exclusion of wss from the current bw is unfair or bias, since this does not promote balance between classes.
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About the bathory card. It was anothers argument, at least you agree that the edition of wss to bw would not dramatically effect the economy related to the cards price.
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About the zeny zink again someone elses argument.
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Merellis Wrote:Mining is not really a good place to gain these particular items seeing as how they have a low rate of appearing and you're more likely to get something you should just NPC then you are to get everything you want for your Forging.Mining refers back to the GM's post it. Basically blacksmith/some other classes has a item generator to increase the circulation of class based items. While wss does not have a item generator. That is unfair in the long list of current mods that adds class based items.
And it isn't a replacement for Brewing seeing as how Fish can only be used in a PVM setting and not in WoE or BG, hell even certain fish aren't allowed into ToH. So this once again isn't an argument for or against WSS in Bee Wings. Moving on.
Its quite funny we would not be having this discussion on fish if its role was not altered.
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Then you go on about GM related decisions. I guess you would add karvo in the first place to bw.
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xD I made on mistake on the placement of bias.
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Regarding the wish list of items that could be added to bee wings. First you agree that wss exclusion from bee wings is bias. You are just trying to counter my argument by saying that then this long list should be added too. On the long list of items that could be useful each should have its time and place, aka not necessarily in bw. Still having item generators for everything else. This does not address the bias nature of why wss does not have a balanced item generator.
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Merellis Wrote:I say you and me agree to disagree and just leave this thread alone for the GM's to ponder over.I think we are getting to that point, however not just yet.
Merellis Wrote:Why? Because you'll never concede and I'll never concede. Because if WSS make it in I will still argue that they and other items shouldn't really be there. If they don't make it in you will still argue that they should be in.A feeling in the back of your head...i just can not loose. Well i have a feeling that it is the process that matters the end result is a mystery in this case.
Merellis Wrote:This entire discussion has gone on a merry go round long enough so lets just end it and stop wasting time with these ridiculous posts.totally agree.
In conclusion. You would rather dramatically alter bw in order to justify wss exclusion from bw/or other item generators. While you leave in items like karvo, that does not equate to balancing bw. Since as previously pointed out karvo's inclusion in bw probably have a more damaging effect than the inclusion of wss. Aka you'd promote items that does not fit into your profile. Just to promote other item generation for other classes, that is bias.
@someone else: retract bw didnt someone say that would be too hard & unfair.
@Gojira lol.
@Merellis totally agree.
@Aaronock hugging. xd That would be nice, as long as he/she is cute.
@ChaosPrince xD I made one mistake on the wording of bias, and as most know it was my post 2nd draft.
RE:??Add WSS to Bee wing! - GM-Rahice - 12-29-2012
Seth~ Wrote:*edit for GM reply* A reply that takes into account the (grand list of arguments for wss inclusion) and the reply to Aaronock in the previous post. Would be greatly appreciated. Mind you I want a fair reply like a GM should act.
Mind you I want something coherent and someone who is capable of understanding what they are trying to force others to comprehend. Where it's an un-biased opinion in the first place... But, like Demishock says, we don't always get what we want.
Opinions are opinions. If you don't like what I said and think that it's unfair, Get Over It. ^_^ I certainly took into consideration what I read when I said that, and this.
Of course, this by all means is no attempt to silence you or some other form of random thought you'll claim that I've tried to do. Just a little smidgen of clarity.
If you're so intent on this, you should probably send a very shortened version of your ranting and raving, or what you want to call sense, to Pandora in a Support Ticket. I will gladly let her know it's there, and put it on the Meeting List.
Just a warning: Seeing how many people said no, don't get upset and throw a hissy fit if it doesn't become implemented. If it does, don't get braggy and start rubbing it in peoples faces. That's just rude.. ^_^
RE: ??Add WSS to Bee wing! - Ptah - 12-29-2012
GM-Rahice Wrote:If it does, don't get braggy and start rubbing it in peoples faces. That's just rude.. ^_^
But what's the point in being victorious without rubbing it in your opponent's face?!
*On a side note*
/yawn
Don't you get bored of this? I'd quit on page 2 >.>
RE: Add WSS to Bee wing! - Seth~ - 12-29-2012
@Ptah lol.
@GM-Rahice.
Why hello more noble GM that the previous time. About Pandora. I am not into opening Pandora's box she can if she so desires. I have clear and simple point(s):
1:The exclusion of wss from bee wings/or/ other item generators is biased.
2:In order to balance this basically most if not all mods needs to be removed that add a chance of generating a item. Since wss can apparently not have a balanced item generator.??
3: Intervention of Pandora is not necessary, a post clarifying her/gm team justification & and possible actions to be taken would be sufficient. Since most ppl do not want wss added in bee wings.??
4:In retrospect. About your argument on opinion. As long as it remains your personal opinion and not the opinion of the GM teams official response. I am happy. Your opinion can still sway ppl opinion and thus should not be aired as publicly as you did. However since you've aired it you did not explain yourself.
5: I do not rub. I just want to claim this as a personal victory. Since no one can say that without dramatically altering current item generators. That leaving wss out of bee wings would be fair and unbiased.
6:
GM-Rahice Wrote:I will gladly let her know it's there, and put it on the Meeting Listcan you just like ask her to generate a response by herself or a offical GM response. Since otherwise it would be kinda useless, what would I say...um GM-Panda lady...what do you think of my masterpiece?
RE: Add WSS to Bee wing! - Merellis - 12-29-2012
We're never going to agree so stop saying I suddenly agree with your point of view.
Can a GM please close this thread as there is not going to be any new information or arguments until a GM gives a yes or no to this being added?
![[Image: B77fx.gif]](http://i.imgur.com/B77fx.gif)
RE: Add WSS to Bee wing! - Seth~ - 12-29-2012
@Merellis Then justify your point.
Recap. I've made a badly constructed list of arguments (by me & other). You went and replied to most items on the list. I posted again trying to identify the flaws/or agreement in your counter arguments.
Now to conclude if you do not counter my argument in such a way that proves me wrong you in fact concede that:??
Seth~ Wrote:In conclusion. You would rather dramatically alter bw in order to justify wss exclusion from bw/or other item generators. While you leave in items like karvo, that does not equate to balancing bw. Since as previously pointed out karvo's inclusion in bw probably have a more damaging effect than the inclusion of wss. Aka you'd promote items that does not fit into your profile. Just to promote other item generation for other classes, that is bias.If you can not prove my argument flawed then why bother? This would however basically result in you conceding to my conclusion.??