Quote:To start, my point was never to drop to 1 castle. When I joined WoE there was Prontera which typically had high eco and was defended, and Payon which had little or no eco. People actually defended Prontera and others actually rushed. DoE experienced more than a few Behe and KoJ combined rushes into the emp room. Typically people fought for the eco and then at the last minute someone would go to secure Payon cuz they couldn't take Prontera from the defending guild whether it was Behe or DoE. KoJ was still fairly new at the time so trying to say "well 2 castles didn't work since KoJ didn't stand a chance" well, that could easily be said because they were a new guild. They have pretty decent numbers now, and from what I hear more class variety and basic gears, so it would be fun to see how the KoJ now would have faired in that situation compared to what KoJ was at the time.
Before I say address this, I need to get this one out there. KoJ- you're an awesome guild. You guys always keep trying and are really quite tenacious when push comes to shove.
However, go back to where I list out who was online when we were fighting during WoE. Note some very simple things, like who has trans classes and who doesn't. KoJ has a lot of non-trans, so they're not going to be as much of a challenge. There's no cart term, edp, AD, or fast charge asura, and you're thinking they're going to stand a chance against DoE in defense mode? Yes, they do have a few members that are trans and are in their 90's, but when the core of the guild is non-trans, they're not exactly a threat to a guild of 20+ people who are all trans, all 99/70, and all defending one warp portal.
Also on that topic- that time period worked because there was a balance between the guilds. Behe was able to kill DoE with work, DoE was able to kill Behe, and KoJ occasionally did something (Sorry KoJ, I really do like you, but the time period mentioned wasn't exactly your strongest showing). You want to recreate that right now when Behe can't pull a full party of 12 people together? When 4srs can't pull a full party of 12 people together? When KoJ can't pull a full party of trans characters together? That time period was the way it was because we all could get 20+ people online every WoE, and currently we can't do that because people don't want to be there. There's no motivation for them to join or be involved, so it turns even more into bashing our heads against the wall.
Quote:I'm also not saying that people should find running into a dead end fulfilling and something to want to do, but that's what competition is. You go, get rolled, then improve/increase numbers and try again. You don't fail an exam and sit there telling the exam that if it was easier you'd have passed it until it agrees to become easier and then you suddenly get higher marks, you go home, study/improve yourself and try to do better on the next one.
I don't enjoy the comparision of WoE as a test. That means that there is a level that you can just study up to and suddenly win. I much rather have this as a race where you're competing against other people, like track and field where you're training and practicing to beat the person in the lane next to you.
Yes, competition does work that way. Competition does mean that some times things won't work out for you, you dust yourself off and try again. But, most people will give up if the 'dust yourself off and try again' portion of competition is all that they do. If they never achieve victory, if there's no chance of winning any time soon, and there's no reward for even trying, no one is going to want to keep trying.
Right now WoE is like a track and field event where there's only rewards for 1-3 place and there happens to be 4 Olympic track stars racing. Sure, you can join in on another lane, but good luck trying to beat out that person in the next lane to you who just set the world record a few meets ago. It's a competition, but a futile one with no rewards and nothing to show progress. The largest form of progression for a new person in this setting is, "This WoE I was able to use some pots because I didn't die in one hit to everything that touched me", and what sort of reward is that? Good job, you geared up well enough to eat through 300 pots, just to get the same result as when you didn't use any.
Quote: I truly believe it's the morale of the community towards WoE which is the downfall in all of this.
Which is what I'm trying to address with my solution. People hate WoE right now. People are demoralized with it and don't want to touch it, so let's give them a place that will give them a positive experience with WoE. Not WoE-light (aka BG) but an actual WoE setting where they can have fun, and participate in a real WoE environment without bashing their heads against the wall every time they play.
By expanding they get a positive experience. By condensing down, WoE becomes even more elitist and less inviting.
Quote:WoE to my definition is a competitive event. In which people work to gear themselves, work to build numbers, work to make strategies, and then go and compete against other weaker and/or stronger guilds
And that would happen in a larger WoE setting. People would become involved that don't typically WoE. They would have to work on gearing and becoming stronger to compete with others. YOU might not have to gear and strategize, but that's why it's called top tier, or end game, gear. By opening up castles new people to the WoE scene will be able to do just what you consider the core of WoE, which is what I think is important.
Quote:I also said in my post, not to negate "everyone else in the guild" which you keep doing lol. Yes, one guild sends out sinxs to randomly break things with 0 intent on defending anything, but that doesn't mean that the lokis/performers, hwiz, crea, champs, and everything else magically vanish/thin out for 0 reason.
I never said that the guild would be reduced down to 0 just by sending out some people to break. I did say that the defense would be weaker by whatever amount of people sent out to play in other castles. You might still be able to pull a full, top tier defense, with the people left in the castle, but no matter how you cut it whoever is missing is one less person that an offensive force has to kill to make their way to the emp. The defense is not non-existant, it's just weaker, and sometimes weaker is all someone needs to break in and do something.
Quote:If you get rolled in WoE, stop blaming the people who rolled you for being "too strong/OP", there not being enough castles, or whatever. Get up, dust yourself off, re-evaluate and try again.
For how long?
How long should a new member to the server keep brushing it off?
Sooner or later it's going to become, 'this sucks, I give up'.
Yes, there should be some sense of challenge and hardship, but without the possibility of maybe getting what you're actually trying for, or even getting close to it, people will give up.
Change spots with the newbie for just a second. You're new to the server and don't want to join a pre-established guild. You spend a month leveling your character and you think you're pretty awesome because you have some basic, basic, gears that you farmed all by yourself. You decide that now that you are lvl 90-ish non-trans that you should give WoE a shot. You walk into the main castle and can't make it past the entrance. You go to the sub-castles, and you can possibly make it to the pre-emp, but no matter what, no matter where you are, you die in one shot. Everyone seems to be super powerful and way beyond your level.
For a casual gamer, they're going to stop right there, turn around, and never come back because of how inaccessible it is.
Trans WoE is holly and shall not be messed with, but try that scenario out one of these days with non-trans WoE. Start a new account, don't join a pre-established non-trans guild, and see if you can get anywhere close to the emp. If you're not that way, camp the portal to the pre-emp and see if you can kill anyone that walks through. There's going to be no, 'I almost killed them' but there is going to be a lot of, 'well that was pointless to even try'.
Quote:I think 20 is too much of an extreme in another direction, we don't even have a big enough community for that imo
It might be true that 20 is too much, but what about 15 or 10? Do we have a large enough server for 10 to be open and allow new people to experience WoE in a positive light? I'm pushing for more castleS, not just one castle more, but multiple. Hopefully through all of my posts it's been shown that more castles would mean more action, more people involved because of accessibility to a less frustrating WoE, less turtling (don't get your panties in a bunch, I said less, it'll still be there, but it'll be less), and could help the server in ways outside of just WoE (zenny sink, market stability, ect).
I'll ask it again because it's yet to be answered; what good would reducing castles do for the server? What PR spin could Pandora & co. possibly put on that to bring people in?
Merellis- WoE 2.0
I agree 2.0 would be fun to have, but my fears for that follow much of my fear of how normal WoE has been treated with this server. If it was to be implemented, most likely there would only be two WoE 2.0 castles open, and they wouldn't be open at the same time as normal WoE because that's just crazy talk. After the sufficient amount of complaining and arguing about WoE 2.0 times, it would get started, and then WoE 2.0 would become normal WoE with different rules. The same veteran players would set up camp and play it, and the same veteran players would complain that there was no activity, and the same veteran players would scare off any new blood the server might be able to bring in by advertising that we now have 2.0. We would still be stuck in the exact same situation that we have now, just with different rules at a different time of the week.
