Why is Alde/Nontrans Castles There?

[Jasper]

Why are you worrying about moving alde to a new date? Clearly you can hold a castle cant you? I mean you only have been holding it for 5 months from the "attackers." It seems to me that the reason you argue against it is because clearly you know that you are doing no work at the moment and when it comes time to step up you wont have what it takes.

Currently, moving alde to a different time sounds like the best option, hell even reduce the eco even more. Move alde to a Saturday for an hour like on Wednesday. Choosing a time and date really isnt that hard.

[Neuneck]

Or make it JFF fun WoE with 0 econ, if it's for training purposes...

[Général_Argos]

Arguments were as follow :
1) We have two events occuring at the same time, in this case regular-woe and retro-woe.??Dual clienting being forbiden on hero, being at 2 events at the same time can pose problems.??
2) The reward of the retro-woe is too much for what it takes in term of investment of efforts.??No materials to hunt for bombs and edps and the such.??On that point, you are here since, hmmm 5 months and you have the arrogance to determine what requires effort and what doesn't in term of game balance on the server???Claiming that something requires effort while your the one doing it is pure and simple self-condescendance.??You never saw the other side of the board.??(Same was for lw in their early days)

Hmm...

1.

Giving it's own time slot would provide the same guild to own both trans WoE and non-trans WoE without increasing their guildies amount.

Sophia also posted several more points about this. Too lazy to quote more.

Lazyness won't bring you anywhere.??Anyway, how is that quote from sophia refuting the problem???It is her speculation about what would happen.??Even if it happens, where is the problem?

2. Firstly, thank you sir(sarcasm), for calling me names like arrogant and implying since I am newer than you that I cannot even tell if there are enemies attacking Alde or not. If you continue such behaviour I will simply ignore you. People who want to resolve an issue do not namecall.

I didn't called you names.??I said that what you were saying was arrogant.??There is a difference.??Beside, this is not about are there ennemies yes-no question.??

Simply because you were a member of LW does not mean you are a god nor that your word means more than mine, particularly in this issue, where I personally have been involved in Alde and you have simply been looking at it from afar.

And again, you know nothing.??I have been involved in alde for longer than you before you even existed on hero.??

And as for the 2nd point... it's contradictory

First people say they don't want to go to Alde and give up on the great rewards of Trans WoE, because Alde rewards suck.
Then you say Alde rewards are great and takes no effort to get.

You canno't compare my opinion with the one of those people.??I am not them and they are not me.??Being separate beings, we are able to have different opinions. Thus, no contradiction.??

Yes we don't have to hunt for AD and EDP mats, we still have to convert, fish, speed pot, berserk, blue gem, trap, etc.

Wich is a lot less effort.??

That's also why Alde does not have a 100 eco cap. It has 20.

Because I argued about it, because it was 100 eco when it started.??Again, no contradiction.??I am just continuing what I have started

If you think it takes no effort for good rewards. Come take it.

Ok.

Oh wait.

I already did.

2 years ago.

[GM-Aki]

Would someone have the time to go thru the whole thread and make a list of all the ideas here? I'm pretty much asking for a concise resumed post and list of what is proposed and the major thoughts behind those ideas. I don't want any chest beating hair showing I be HE-MAN in that wrap up! This will help us to have a positive conversation and brain storming in the gm section without being influenced by the whining and attacks that just don't belong in this thread. Would one person be open to doing this for us?

We did want to brain storm on Alde, well I did, except I do get at a point in my brainstorming where I'm drawing a blank. So, YOU, players are as usually being faster than a speeding bullet and my time and ability to try to be pre-emptive ... here's another one just because

So... o_o any takers?

I could continue to just write on this subject but I think I have made my point. Well I hope so because if not then I have a problem myself being concise and effective in my reply here. I, of course, will try to stop writing in this reply and let you all wonder at my ability to write things and quite frankly just continue writing and writing.. and wri..................................


Bye!

[Général_Argos]

1) Close alde and retro-woe

2) Set alde to 0 chest 0 reward to have it as a training facility for practice for newcommers

3) Set alde another time of the week, make it a woe that everyone can attend (and open a second castle to adjust for the probable increased number of participants)

[Kretzer]

1) Close alde and retro-woe

Too extreme

2) Set alde to 0 chest 0 reward to have it as a training facility for practice for newcommers

Too Boring. It does solve the problem of Alde being a constant income source for little to no effort, but "training" WoE is a boring a unrewardfull feature.

3) Set alde another time of the week, make it a woe that everyone can attend

._.; Is that even possible? Id say just go for something like...

Tuesday - PreTrans WoE - Thursday Trans 1 Hour - Sunday Trans 2 Hour

[Yuriohs]

Would someone have the time to go thru the whole thread and make a list of all the ideas here? I'm pretty much asking for a concise resumed post and list of what is proposed and the major thoughts behind those ideas. I don't want any chest beating hair showing I be HE-MAN in that wrap up! This will help us to have a positive conversation and brain storming in the gm section without being influenced by the whining and attacks that just don't belong in this thread. Would one person be open to doing this for us?

We did want to brain storm on Alde, well I did, except I do get at a point in my brainstorming where I'm drawing a blank. So, YOU, players are as usually being faster than a speeding bullet and my time and ability to try to be pre-emptive ... here's another one just because

So... o_o any takers?

I could continue to just write on this subject but I think I have made my point. Well I hope so because if not then I have a problem myself being concise and effective in my reply here. I, of course, will try to stop writing in this reply and let you all wonder at my ability to write things and quite frankly just continue writing and writing.. and wri..................................


Bye!

The Poll?

[Diallo]

Arguments were as follow :
1) We have two events occuring at the same time, in this case regular-woe and retro-woe.??Dual clienting being forbiden on hero, being at 2 events at the same time can pose problems.??
2) The reward of the retro-woe is too much for what it takes in term of investment of efforts.??No materials to hunt for bombs and edps and the such.??On that point, you are here since, hmmm 5 months and you have the arrogance to determine what requires effort and what doesn't in term of game balance on the server???Claiming that something requires effort while your the one doing it is pure and simple self-condescendance.??You never saw the other side of the board.??(Same was for lw in their early days)

Hmm...

1.

Giving it's own time slot would provide the same guild to own both trans WoE and non-trans WoE without increasing their guildies amount.

Sophia also posted several more points about this. Too lazy to quote more.

Lazyness won't bring you anywhere.??Anyway, how is that quote from sophia refuting the problem???It is her speculation about what would happen.??Even if it happens, where is the problem?

2. Firstly, thank you sir(sarcasm), for calling me names like arrogant and implying since I am newer than you that I cannot even tell if there are enemies attacking Alde or not. If you continue such behaviour I will simply ignore you. People who want to resolve an issue do not namecall.

I didn't called you names.??I said that what you were saying was arrogant.??There is a difference.??Beside, this is not about are there ennemies yes-no question.??

Simply because you were a member of LW does not mean you are a god nor that your word means more than mine, particularly in this issue, where I personally have been involved in Alde and you have simply been looking at it from afar.

And again, you know nothing.??I have been involved in alde for longer than you before you even existed on hero.??

And as for the 2nd point... it's contradictory

First people say they don't want to go to Alde and give up on the great rewards of Trans WoE, because Alde rewards suck.
Then you say Alde rewards are great and takes no effort to get.

You canno't compare my opinion with the one of those people.??I am not them and they are not me.??Being separate beings, we are able to have different opinions. Thus, no contradiction.??

Yes we don't have to hunt for AD and EDP mats, we still have to convert, fish, speed pot, berserk, blue gem, trap, etc.

Wich is a lot less effort.??

That's also why Alde does not have a 100 eco cap. It has 20.

Because I argued about it, because it was 100 eco when it started.??Again, no contradiction.??I am just continuing what I have started

If you think it takes no effort for good rewards. Come take it.

Ok.

Oh wait.

I already did.

2 years ago.

LOL.

I'd safely say here that Krim wins, without a doubt. God. I hope you're back krim <3

[Nidsrule]

1) If you want to move it to a new time slot, what is the time? how long per non-trans woe? how often? what date? does trans woe also need adjustments to accommodate? Will new time make it more difficult for events such as ToH to be hosted or interfere with any other events? Does the increased frequency of another type of WoE affect players in their preparations for WoE? Does trans WoE need adjustment to accommodate?

These are the options I can see in terms of organizing and spacing out retro WoE:

• Once a week; held 2 hours before trans WoE on Wednesday. Have it last an hour, so people are able to get organized for trans WoE afterward if they wish to participate in both. The issue with running it once a week is then one guild gets to benefit from the drops an entire week; further fine tuning of the Econ system for retro WoE would be required.
  
• Twice a week; both lasting an hour. Have it occur around the same time frame as what Sunday WoE runs on and have each retro WoE occur a day after the current trans WoE layout (Thursday and Monday, 7-9 pm starting time)
  
• Twice a week, one hour each; first instance as described in point one, second instance following point two (perhaps have it on Monday).
  

I'd lean more towards option 2 (assuming a decent level of rewards is kept). If econ were to be removed entirely then it really wouldn't matter if only one retro WoE was held a week.

2) If you want to increase/decrease eco formula, what should be the new formula? Do take into account that increasing eco cap doesn't always mean an increase in chest, because you can change the equation for number of eco to constitute a chest. Vice versa is also true that lowering the cap isn't always an end to chests. So, give an actual formula if you want to change how eco works in Aldebaran. (note: it is hard coded 12 AM of every day, you *will* get some number of chests. It's not possible within our limits to change this rule. Likewise the guild ability of eco development for 2 points instead of 1 is also not going to change.)

2b) If you also want to change the content of the chests, what should they be? Do trans chests need to change to accommodate the changes?

First of all, how much flexibility is there when it comes to implementing a completely separate econ system for each form of WoE?

Assuming it is possible to add in an entirely different system for retro WoE, while keeping trans WoE as it is:

• Leave the trans WoE drops/econ system as it is.
  
• Set alde econ to being chests = (econ/5) + 1, for the case where there are two instances of retro WoE a week. In the case it only occurs once a week; chests = (econ/10) + 1.
  
• Have separate castle drops for Alde (detailed below).
  

For the new drops, switch the focus away from purely gear drops to a mixture of gears and materials generally used in trans WoE. Once again, I'm not sure about how much flexibility there is with with the econ system, but if it's possible this is what I had in mind:

• One of the chests (the + 1 chest used in the econ formula given above) would continue to drop gears. These should be focused mainly on being usable by all classes (both trans and non trans). Example list:
  • Shoes, mufflers, guards at a high drop rate (75-100%).
    
  • Formal suits, glittering jackets at a medium rate (25-50%)
    
  • Valk shield at a low rate (<1%)
    
  • No god item parts
    
• The remaining chests would drop WoE supplies. I'd even suggest making a new set of items, similar in style to how Gravity hands out some cash shop items, in the form of boxes (name them "WoE Supplies *1-blah*) which when used give out predefined stacks of items. Basic idea in terms of what items and amounts of each, follows:
  • Witched Starsands - 100+ per stack
    
  • Blue Herbs - 50 per stack
    
  • Immortal Hearts - 50+ per stack
    
  • Karvo - 10-20 per stack
    
  • Speed Potions - 5 per stack
    
  • Elemental Converters - 5 of each per box
    
  • Crystal Fragments - 25 per stack
    
  • Interested in more suggestions
    

4) If you think that Aldebaran castle is beyond save and needs absolute closing, what should be done for the guild currently owning the castle, if any? According to those who believe in this, GMs need to forcibly cease the castle away from the current owners (unlike previous payon castle where we ask a guild leader to unconditionally surrender the castle), so should compensation be given? If so, what should it be? Does trans castle need to change accordingly since the total number of castles changed?

Regardless of whether it is moved or simply shut down, the number of castles in both retro and trans WoE should remain the same. Focusing the WoEing population into a smaller number of castles will make the fights more interesting/fierce.

5) Changes done to a "heRO feature" by GMs isn't an act that only answers heRO, but also towards all advertisement sites including RMS where "other server players" crawl all the other servers' forums to wait for a chance to make a "false advertisement" call and other ruleshark activity to discredit server reviews/popularity. How should the server prepare for any of these related threats?

In the case that there is advertisement of Alde WoE being a standalone feature, remove it until the changes are made. If it is moved and setup to be a legitimate attempt at creating a retro WoE environment, then you can advertise it as such. I don't see how you can really falsely advertise retro WoE. Either it is implemented by itself and advertised as being a standalone feature of the server or Alde WoE stays the same/gets removed entirely and no changes are required to existing advertisement.

6) For any sort of change related to this castle, *when* should the change take place? When to execute the plan? How do we choose the date of executing the plans so that it is fair for all guilds (especially if there's a "nerf" or "buff" in prizes/chests?)

Personally I think advance warning of the system being implemented of at least a month would allow players (guilds) to organize new characters specifically for retro WoE. This time frame is of course, limited heavily by how fast the GM team can get everything ready. Don't see how the date really matters unless you wanted to implement it along side the start of school holidays or something along those lines to attract more interest.

If there's anything I missed, let me know. Didn't answer point 3 because I don't think Alde should be closed outright and the whole compensation thing is going to cause controversy either way.

[Neuneck]

[*] The remaining chests would drop WoE supplies. I'd even suggest making a new set of items, similar in style to how Gravity hands out some cash shop items, in the form of boxes (name them "WoE Supplies *1-blah*) which when used give out predefined stacks of items. Basic idea in terms of what items and amounts of each, follows:

• Witched Starsands - 100+ per stack
  
• Blue Herbs - 50 per stack
  
• Immortal Hearts - 50+ per stack
  
• Karvo - 10-20 per stack
  
• Speed Potions - 5 per stack
  
• Elemental Converters - 5 of each per box
  
• Crystal Fragments - 25 per stack
  
• Interested in more suggestions
  

I just LOVE that idea! please, if you are going to fiddle around/add new chest drops give it a thought!! Rewarding those who managed to hold the castle with usables is awesome!