January 2012 ToH Appreciation Thread

[Shinigami l0_0l]

If there was, nothing else would have been needed. First step of troubleshooting - making sure the problem actually exists.

@namine
yes, DC is unpreventable problem, i ask that question for that statement of circe.
s/he should realize that the DC itself is a problem and it exist.

i just dont know why they move to gamble on autofix without really checking the 2nd wave situation. i dont know if they dont have the abilities to throughly check the situation or they just lazy. but i guess, they can (at least) warp into the combat area on ToH room to check the situation inside, or maybe PMing the player.

if they dont know who's inside, why they didnt take a note when each wave enter the combat arena? those list are important went away quickly in chatlog with/without DC. they should make a note about this somewhere i guess. unless if they didnt think that this list arent important.

and starting the 3rd wave and forbiding the player to enter the warp is a better choice as well. even if they (the host) cant enter the combat area, it's enough to hope for the autofix to works. they didnt forbid the 3rd wave. this is the reason why this problem become such a mess.


and about the lack of knowledge part, it because circe know about the timer attached to player and glyph didnt know. i guess it's important for the host to know this. and they didnt rly know how the autofix works, right? they should know this as a ToH host imo.


about the i want everything perfectly part, i never expect any omnipotent GM. but again, i sense that GM can made a better decision that time, but they didnt rly check the situation throughly and made a gambling decision. i guess they should apologize for this.

that's all

[Snowhawk]

They have nothing to apologize for...They did everything they could and to the best of their abilities. EVERYONE keeps telling you this. YOU owe them an apology for being such a jerk.

[Deimos]

Not demanding perfection but demanding everything better by ranting it out. You will improve the world around you in a very effective way.

Again, it's easier to point out problems after the accident happen. All your suggestions should have been put in more civil/appropriate way for them. Moreover, make sure you understand the system before you take place as a consultant. Thus, cut the bull crap.

[Firenza]

@raphael

Well, each monster have their unique abilities and stats, if they were all made to be equally easy or hard at all times for all classes then they would always be the same, and it would be no fun. Some classes just can't kill some monsters, or take a very long time to do so. I never expect 50 points from Monsters because no matter how good a Sniper is at pvm there are monsters out there that we cannot kill. That's just my opinion though.

Were you around when we had 90+ people in ToH? Now THOSE were some crowded item trials. As for the creation lists, it takes getting used to. When I started ToH-ing my friends told me to not count on getting 70 points because item trial is so hectic for first timers and I would most probably not do very well in it since I had no idea where everything was. The more you do it, the more you learn, remember where things are, etc. The real problem was the 26 Genie Lamps imo.

As for mass pvp's DCs, I don't think there is a fix yet. Hope I'm wrong.

[Namine]

Trials 4 and 5 were NOT FAIR >:| Bradium Golems have 88 def how the hell do you kill 3 of them in two minutes without AD or a prof. IMO toh mobs should present a more or less equal challenge to all classes, at least the ones suited to it not be something that only 1 or 2 classes can kill and then tell everyone else to GTFO. And Seyren OMG. Not nice. AND if the idea is to make us work for it then more time would be really nice in the last 2 rounds here, as a thought.

Again it's that issue of expectation. You are expected to only get 30-35 points in monster trial! If you got 35+ already, you're doing very, very well. If you get below 30, you can probably get better. GMs balance all trials not necessarily so that you *can* get 50 points. If people get 50 points consistently (especially if those people are all snipers), then the GMs need to re-evaluate their plans.

Remember: some of the trials, especially round 5, are generally chosen as survival trial, 5 or 0. 10 is a "woah what?" GMs are out for blood! Grab your 5 and consider yourself successful.

"Oh no you can only kill them as profs!" Now you know what the profs feel against all those monsters of high holy/dark that are usually a sigh of relief for melee and snipers.

But all of this is part of your learning to tackle the ToH. After one or two more trials like this, I'm sure you'll get the hang of it.

Item trial:[/b]
First of all is there somewhere I can see the creation list for the crafted items? BESIDES IN THE TRIAL? A lot of people already know what to hunt. Also its too hard imo. When classes like WS and snipers can barely get past 30 points you know everyone else is just going to suck.[/b]

Thus why they give you a choice of pvp trial. Some classes are just weaker at pvm than others. Thus why there's options for you.

Don't forget that once again, the trial is meant to be balanced out at 25 only. Hitting above 35 is insanely high. 40+ is cream of the crop. 45-50, I'll personally consider that a miscalculation for the GMs to think about.

As for the item creation list, is it on the wiki? I remember writing in my sticky thread that one of the best way to prepare for the item trial is to find a veteran player/guildmate to show you the way. Item trial is all about research and proper preparation before you even enter the trial. Try starting the trial hunting for item number 3 first. New players tend to work from top to bottom. Work from bottom to top may result in less competition for the same monsters.

Too few mobs = too much KSing and running around looking for monsters in time you should be spending killing. This was after a certain % of the people just left due to the trauma in the earlier trial.

Just a thought but it should be more about skill than luck too.

More about preparation than luck. Once you know the type/element of the monsters, and realizing that item trial is all out offense (bring them porcelio/agav wings!), it's all number crunching if you can OHKO everything.

However, I never liked item trial either because it's static every single month with little variation, unlike any of the other trials. Monster is different every time. PvP you fight different opponents every time. Trivia the questions are also different. Yet item trials... same mob every time. That's my personal thing against it.

The items required are generally such that achieving a maximum score within the time limit is... impossible. And worse not even CLOSE to what anyone could call possible.

But that's the idea! The challenge of item trial isn't to do everything, but you pick and choose. Beat the system and maximize your score, given that you can't get it all. You choose which items is easy, and ditch the ones that are too hard. Remember that you can get 2 points for an item category as long as you have just 1. It's a smart move to only synthesize ONE item and get a 2 for it, and so on. Item trial is again, all about research, preparation, and a mix of max/min build to beat the system, getting the most out of the 50 that you CANNOT AND SHOULD NOT get.

Think of it this way: PvP trial you only get either 0, 5 or 10. So on average you only get 25 points in PvP. Therefore, item trial is also balanced so the server *only* get 25 on average too, with variation from 10 to 40.

Also I know that many share this problem but I. Always. DC. during the mass battle. No Ifs or Buts. Always. Since there do exist people who never DC can someone tell me why this occurs? And what i can do to fix it.

Sadly I don't think that it'll be fixed... been a long time problem and a reason why people really frown on how it's worth 10 points which is a lot. Oh well.

All in all a good toh and it was undeniably fun =) TY

I'm sure Circe, Forge and Glyph will appreciate your comments =)


Just remember: a breakdown of what is EXPECTED of you to get wings:

35 monsters, +/- 10
25 items, +/- 10

1-2 trivia to catch up the deficit, then you will BARELY get wings. Remember, it is a TRIAL of heroes!

People with 135 points have no life! *pif*

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As for the questions about GM's abilities in a ToH, I think that even the others' responses have covered it pretty well. I don't have anything extra to add to my previous long post.

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@Tulwar: Hello too :3 your sarcasm is always missed in forums for destressing!

@Aaron: HIIIIII! Persona 3 is the sexiest game since sex! <3333 *playing The Answer now*

@Jaque: hello long time no see indeed! How's life without being struck by 20+ bolts of lightning summoned by invisible forces in the fields these days in heRO?

[Shinigami l0_0l]

the words "everything" is not cheap. people keep saying that the host already did everything they could.

but by the fact that the thing called "everything" takes only 1-2min and the example of things that could be done?
i guess it can't call be called everything.

but there's still lot of possibility for any better solution as well of course.

[Deimos]

Indeed everything is not cheap. Expect professional service, how much do you pay per month on the free private server?

Stop giving them hard time with rant, you are not helping the server in anyway. Give them suggestion, if you think you did, then you have problem presenting it. You should be able to see from number of post replied to you from numerous of peps here. Again, Ranting not helping in many situation/condition, Constructive Criticism should do better.

[Firenza]

^Oi nub don't just link a google search! Lazy pig!

[Deimos]

*changing it to Bing*

[Aaronock]

the words "everything" is not cheap. people keep saying that the host already did everything they could.

but by the fact that the thing called "everything" takes only 1-2min and the example of things that could be done?
i guess it can't call be called everything.

but there's still lot of possibility for any better solution as well of course.

LMAO dude, they had to make a slight gamble here. If they sat around taking over 30 minutes to fix the situation you'd have people feeling you're wasting their time, or in some extreme cases they'd quit the server.

They probably didn't fully anticipate what happened...happened. Hindsight is 20/20 you know?

And most likely, they will try to implement some fixes since this situation happened. That's what patches are freaking for.

@Nami: Yah, told you Persona 3 is worth playing.