BG

[Child of Bodom]

So this morning I watched as 12 or more people sat at BG and grinded exp. They did a method of if you get drafted to the red team you win. I have a problem with that lol. Why should sitting around for 7 or 8 minutes give you exp. BG already gives you BG points AND woe points now so why cant we lower the exp bg gives to promote more partying. Its not like there isnt a population as i said there was 12 or more bging, and several others on server most of whom said theyd love to party sometime. But why bother when its hard to go to some places because of quests like in nydd or name, when u can sit around for 8 minutes and get more exp then u MIGHT earn anyways. I think BG is supposed to be a way to gear you for pvp and woe not a way to lvl ur char. I think you should get a exp bonus and stuff ya but not enough where a 98 trans can 99 in only 10 hours of sitting around doing nothing. Its basically promoting this server as there are no parties ever as Ive heard countless times from people. Theres my suggestion. Your welcome.

EDIT: Why not make the BG and WoE points higher on the bigger BG options so theres still a reason to BG instead of exp, that way they get valuable consumables that theyd otherwise have to spend hours to grind which is like the most off putting thing about woe for more casual players.
Kinda just building on the whole BG is meant to get you ready for WoE and PvP thing instead of a free exp machine.

[The Legendary Joe]

+1

If you're max level, that exp's kind of useless anyway. Why does demi-human exp gears boost that exp? That also seems stupid. If exp has to stay, I'd like an option where "I can shut off exp/woe points for more BG points or vice versa"

[Richart]

I've noticed that Battlegrounds here are a joke, and Dicing/Red-Team-Wins/etc are just a symptom of that.

Issue 1: They're Just Broken
The Battlegrounds on this server limp along as a whole, and it's a little sad to see.
KvM functions fine, it's hard to fudge up deathmatch.
Mini-WoE is fundamentally broken, since the second Emperium break instantly wins, rather than using a KotH or time-attack mechanic; there's literally no reason not to subvert this game.
Terria and Flavius fail to start constantly, leaving the Battlegrounds locked for upwards of 15 minutes without use, and in Flavius' case there are disgusting issues with Guardian AI/the map, allowing them to be dragged out of the crystal room by their own team and into the other team's spawn, or kited around the map and hidden from opponents that are required to kill them.

Tell me, do those sound like the kind of thing everyone wants to take seriously?


Issue 2: Ease of Access
Battlegrounds are hilariously easy to access; a global server announcement, free warp, and 3k/15k entry fee turn what would be a notable PvP event into an easily chainable joke used solely for coasting from 89 to 99.
Everyone is invited to Battlegrounds, and it takes less than minute to stop whatever you're doing to go idle there in Izlude; I've seen more parties drop from grinding to do BGs than player/GM-started events.
This would be understandable if Battlegrounds took place only once an hour, after all nobody would want to miss this event, but this is never the case, because if 4+ players gather, at least one of them will have keys. This means that BGs, almost without fail, will always turn into a BG-Chain, but the issue doesn't end there. If you have six or more players in a BG, you will earn enough War Points to infinitely chain Battlegrounds.

If something takes no effort to access, no effort to activate, and no effort to join, then why would anyone treat them as anything but a handout?


Issue 3: Ridiculous Rewards
Battlegrounds provide some of the most powerful equipment in the game for PvP, of with BG-Weapons dominate hands down; you would think this reason enough to participate in them, right?
Well, in addition to that, they also give War Points, which allow the purchase of WoE consumables, more PvP gear, headwear, Battleground Keys, and more. Sounds like a fruitful amount of rewards for a PvP event, right?
Hold onto your goddamn hat, because Battlegrounds also give so much EXP that levelling a character 89->99, even trans, is common practice here. I have seen 98-Trans characters bragging in Izlude about how they make almost 2% a win because of their stacked +EXP%, and double that in Job EXP.

This amount of reward, for this little time and effort, is absolutely inexcusable. Battlegrounds aren't just "Easy and non-serious" at this point, there's almost no point in doing anything else!


Final Issue: No Reason To Win
In all my time on the server I have seen people flaunt their Glorious sets and tear me to shreds with their Glorious weapons, and walk with Medals of Honor dangling from their pockets like loose change; but none of them seem to talk about BGs. Most players don't even care about fixing the matches, they're just overwhelmed by sheer apathy towards it all, and only lash out at players trying to fight because they're wasting time, because after all, losing is just 30% less points, right?

There are no announcements of PvP rank. No tally of badassdom and marked victories. Nobody has organized a team of players to fight in BGs together. There is no accessible scoreboard of Battleground Wins and statues in town of those who have dominated the PvP scene independently or with their friends.


Summary
With what I've described here, I hope anyone can see just how frustratingly broken Battlegrounds are here. They're hilariously easy to start, join, and chain, are legitimately broken even if played seriously, and give absurd rewards for minimal player input and effort without giving them any sort of meaningful status or fame for victory.
It's a system so eager to be used like this, I'd call it Bug Abuse if this were a server I worked on.


Suggestions
Remove EXP from Battleground: BGs as an EXP source is simply not right, especially at this sheer amount, removing the EXP gain as a whole is the most direct and effective option.
Change:Replace EXP Rewards with the ability to purchase Battle Manuals with BG Points. This promotes doing BGs with geared 99s, and playing once you have all the BG Points you need for your character.

Remove Battleground Keys from the War Store: BGs should not be a self-sufficient event. A group of six players can stockpile more and more keys without end, and spam BGs to their heart's desire.
Change: Add Battleground Keys as a drop-reward in events such as Poring Smash. Keep Battleground Keys to Nobility, Events, and trades.

Fix Battlegrounds: Battlegrounds are nothing but a black hole of fun that lives only to be abused at the moment. Fixing them should be a priority of the team here at HeRO if they want them to be taken seriously and to have their lategame made functional again.
Change: Make Mini-WoE a King of the Hill gamemode, where players have to take the Emperium in a shorter amount of time than their opponent. Remove Tierra/Flavius until they can be launched without costing everyone their entry fee and key. Fix the map/guardian AI so they are no longer trailable by teammates and able to enter enemy spawns/leave their crystal hall.

Allow Team-Based Gameplay:Battlegrounds are a chaotic, disorganized mess; it's no wonder people want it to be over as quickly as possible. Nobody can play together, and there can barely be any communication at all.
Change:Allow players to either start team-based BGs, organize random BGs by party, or some other, more convenient solution that would allow them to play together cohesively.

Introduce Battleground Rankings: Players are filthy animals, and they only value three things: Wealth, Power, and Fame. Give them fame.
Change:Give players a points-based ranking system for Battlegrounds. Put a set of statues in some towns/outside BGs to show who is the best around. Hell, even put a flag down with the team/guilds that are doing the best. Announce when people change rank in the Top 10~25. Make superiority in BGs count for something more than a dick measuring contest against level 93 pre-trans trying to powerlevel.


Thanks for taking the time to read this, I hope this sheds some insight on the general disappointment with Battlegrounds, and that my suggestions can be taken into consideration. I'd love to see BGs made meaningful, and not a faucet for gear and EXP.

[Summerstream]

I honestly remember when BG used to cost 50k, and it was only KVM. The fact it has become spammable to to this extent has become quite frustrating. I agree that BG should not have become a place where you could grind freely for EXP. When I go to BG, it is always to get a gear that I will need later on for WoE or, should I feel like it, dicking around in PvP. (...Which tends to be during ToH.)

Edit in: I mentioned to some friends and Bobo here that a daily limit on how much EXP that can be gained is a better option than fully eliminating it. Or limit how many BG's someone can participate in that will reward experience.

I heard a rumor that Beezlebub wants to play hide and seek with random leveling parties.

I'm glad that telling Bodom to be the devil's advocate in game started something fruitful. I'm glad, truly.

[hachigatsu30]

The way I see it is like this:

1. BG yields insane exp and is spammable. This causes 2 things: PVM parties lose its meaning, and people can be geared for BG/WoE with little to no effort. I just have one question on this matter: is this what the server is aiming now, more people on PVP events like BG and WoE and less people roaming on the world map? I mean, you even had to make a Crazy Merchant to to encourage people to explore... If this is what you want, then congratulations. Well done. If not, then you need to do something about it. I've seen some suggestions already mentioned and most of them sound good enough to me so I won't repeat again.

2. BG matches can be fixed. Well, there's basically nothing we can do about this imo. If there's a way to win, there's always a way to fix the win. So don't QQ over the fact that some people decides to /dice or blue-team-are-losers or whatever is used to fix the winner of a match. And in all fairness, please, don't QQ either if someone decides to be a nasty little prankster and starts shoving his spears up everybody's behinds.
And in my opinion, the most fair way to overcome this is to let whoever keys decide how the match should go, and everybody respect their decisions. It's not that hard to respect people, right? You're a heRO player after all...

@Summer: Hey, it's not a rumor. I love playing hide and seek with Beelzebub.

[The Roger]

Im with who suggest an EXP reduction/removal from BG, and maybe set a new server rule: if u dice/colorteamWins u can be reported, to discourage ppl to do that.

[Angel]

I pretty much suck at everything related to RO but...where is the LIKE button on this?

[Menace651]

Just want to throw in my opinion here.

Yes I agree exp should be reduced or removed from BG. It should not be an easier substitute for party based leveling which is already severely lacking.

As far as the dicing and BG access goes, BG is and should be open to all players and easily accessible just like in the official servers. Limiting or making it harder for new players to join does nothing but harm the player base and makes it harder for newer players to join woe/pvp.

With that being said, if players want to join and dice or take turns farming points then let them. This isn't the only server that people do this on. I've been on a couple different servers and people cheese farm BG points there also. It's just a bad system and people would rather take turns farming points than wasting consumables for a negative return on their investment.

Here are just a couple ideas to make BG more competitive.

1. Alow sharing of BG points on an account between characters so people can actually come on classes they want to pvp with.

2. Increase woe points earned so people won't mind spamming consumables.

3. Reduce or elminate the points earned for losers so people HAVE to win.

[Poofy]

BG is one of my favorite things to do in Ragnarok. I've always enjoyed PvP and BG is like that but with much more direction, without having to have the setup or time for WoE. It's always a bit of a bummer to be part of BG when this is the setup that people go for.

That having been said though, I'm also thankful that it's accessible in the way it is. In the server's current state there's no way you could organize the number of people you do for it if it gave less or it is harder to access. It would become a situation of, if you were at heRO when the population was higher and all you had were vets around, congratulations, you have BG gear. If not, tough. It's an easy line for players to get from having just started to competent for other modes that could use some competition such as WoE, and I think there's a lot of value in that.

All in all I'm pretty torn. It's sometimes a little sad to see the game mode not actually played, but on the other hand I'm thankful it's played at all here.

[GM-Rahice]

We'll all have a talk about this and let you guys know what a formal decision will be, please continue to post suggestions or ideas about BG, we'll take it all into consideration. ^_^