Why is Alde/Nontrans Castles There?

[Ardney Wolf]

Yeah, I remember being called up to defend it. I was new then and confused as heck when I saw an enemy char named Guillermo. All my friends and foes need to break out into nice simple groups, kthx. None of this mixing and matching!

[Proxyt]

So after asking a couple older members, they think we have 1-2 god item drops. As Adrillf pointed out, we are nowhere near close to god EQ. We aren't getting +10 bucklers either, imo the only good thing we're really getting so far is OCA's not tons, but not none, and it's not like I couldn't fish for the 2 hours of WoE and get one instead so not free uber items.

Secondly. Why keep saying Alde is empty for 9 months? Lol we haven't fought in 9 months?
AGAIN, my list of attackers:El Tricolor/Sugar Rush, Wings of Vanir, Gli Atroci, DD/LoA/STD, Nya Nya Crew, Aegis Storm, Ordo Phoenics, Revenga(?), also Dragon Force attacked us.
We don't just "sit and precast air" our precasts turn attackers into air (:

And yeah, Guill's guild was really strong, and well geared too. I recall getting attacked by chars with GTB, several GR's, very powerful gear before. They took our castle at least 3 times, and the other guilds who helped them attack at the same time also took it a few times.

And MY personal opinion, is that Alde as nontrans, RETRO WoE is more balanced class-wise, therefore quite fun. Some classes in trans WoE are just WAY better than others, not so much in Alde.

If you're coming, then perhaps you'll see why we still have Alde. We don't have it for doing nothing, we have it for defeating the others that attacked, not our fault they gave up eventually and never came back.

[Neuneck]

Alright, so, you suggest if something isn't to my liking leave everything i'm doing right now and do something about it? Bullcrap!
I do trans WoE becuase it's fun and it can bring in quite a few good items (not the 2 "o", that's not a typo ;P ). We fight with, say, 60-70 others in a castle, we burn our resources and sometimes even get a castle. Then I look around me, while i'm hunting karvos and white herbs and starsands and panacea and what not and see Alde castle having been broken 7-8 times (i'm not sure on that number) while i've been here, which makes more than a year now.
What you suggested, creating a nontrans part of the guild would weaken our trans team by draining people. Still we'd not be sure to even stand a chance against Bamboo (I have nothing personally against BS, but I still see them breaking the one and only twisted reason Alde still exists).
I am not jealous, but still I think that there's somebody getting something that I try to achieve by working hard, only that they don't have to. And the only godforsaken reason is a FAKE to me (as I explained in earlier posts).

I honestly start thinking about other reasons than nontrans WoE existing for some...

[Général_Argos]

Chop Wrote:Is this just a QQ thread? Obviously this is a lowrate and not everyone is transed or wants to trans so that's why we have nontrans woe. lol

I think you should read the thread in its entirety; I think you missed the complexity of the situation. It is far more complex than "nontrans woe is for nontrans chars obv lolol"

[Proxyt]

Are you saying nontrans WoE is not fun?
As I stated, imo, having played RO for several years, I think retro WoE is more balanced. People who have previously called Alde "kiddie WoE", but been summoned to help us out against for example Sugar Rush, can be quoted saying "Wow... I will never call this kiddie WoE again".
I for one love non-trans WoE.

Just sayin' man, try it before you knock it.
You don't need to delete your trans chars. Just looking at your alt list I see you have 2 chars eligible for Alde. Don't see what you're gettin' at there, the rewards are crappier, but the fighting is not. You're the one that says we are getting something you're trying to achieve by working hard, why WOULDN'T you try to work hard at Alde instead of trans WoE?

Oh right... because our eco caps at 20? Oh but what are we complaining about here? 20 eco getting uber god items and stuff?
If we're getting such great stuff for free, come fight us for it. If it's the same things you're trying to achieve- why not.

Since I've been fighting IN Alde, we've been broken at least 5 times in the past 5 months. Probably more. Just the attackers couldn't get past us once we fortified our def and called in help, so they left. Not our fault man.

If Behe became so strong LoA/DD -plus- NE -plus- Revenga together could not defeat them, tbh, after a month or two you'd probably give up and try something else too. Would they be getting "free" stuff then?

No, it's a show of their strength, they would deserve it. So do we, we've fought hard battles against tough guilds before. If you don't think we deserve it, come fight us, maybe we don't and you can beat us and get our castle and drops.

[Aaronock]

BUT Alde has been advertised WRONGLY then as a castle for newer guilds to fight in. You guys are telling guilds that are NOT new to go fight in Alde...

That's probably where this problem begins, because BS is chock full of vets even OLDER than my butt on this server.??You guys sit here and expect newer guilds to fight BS???We're asking for a change of DAY to fight in Alde so it can actually be a throwback to "retro" times.??I'm not so sure non trans woe is more balanced, in fact it can be even more unfair especially with today's equips and things...but THAT is another discussion for another day!

[Astroboi]

Since BS leader tends to always avoid any discussion about Aldebaran, taking it for granted since GMs are backing it, I will reply for him:

Hello, I have been woeing in payon/pront for the past weeks(months?), I believe that says a lot about Aldebaran's activity.

[Proxyt]

@Ezekiel
According to Indrah, GM's have said that Alde is for retro WoE, not newbie WoE.

@Astroboi
Clarify. I don't think that's a valid point.

1. The past 2-3 weeks has only seen 3 or so guilds attacking us, 1 of which is not worth noting, the other one was last Sunday WoE with Aegis Storm + STD attacking us. Kevin did not -need- to be in Alde recently.

2. Bamboo Squad is not a hardcore WoE guild, if Kevin feels like going to help Behemoth or Apoc, our allies, and leaving our castle in the defence of the rest of us, that's his choice.

WoE is not required. It just so happens we have many members who enjoy WoE and are pretty good at it.

3. Leaving just enough people in Alde to defend attackers, and sending the rest to help allies, then recalling everyone back if there is a mass attack... I call that being tactical/strategic with your resources. (:

[mahawirasd]

it seems to me the notion that "creating a new non-trans retro guild just to give BS a run for their money drains us of people and equips" seems to forget that you guys are allocating that same amount of people and equips to an effort for better gears and/or better action (for those adrenaline junkies)...

thus economically speaking; it seems that the main reason most people opt for trans WOE is because, to them, the BCR (Benefit-Cost-Ratio) for attacking-holding alde is less than trans WOE.

In that respect, do you not notice how BS members, in guarding Alde, forgoes their chance to gain better gears and/or action from the trans castles (which has the potential for better eco and better action)?

so if you feel that BS is getting it easy, then allocate your resources (both personnel and equips) appropriately to give them a run for their money. But don't complain "aw if we do that then we can't do trans WOE"...

BS members, IF they are as "experienced" and as "well-equipped" as you seem to picture them, should then be able to easily open up a can of whup-ass on you guys (be it on trans or non-trans).
But hey, then why the (put expletive remark here) are they sitting around in alde with their non-trans chars for meh action potential and meh eco potential?

to me, non-trans chars are a challenge in their own right due to their limits. Trans chars also have their limits, but those limits are definitely more flexible than non-trans as they have more access to more things (skills and equips). You have to appreciate the fact that perhaps mastering non-trans limits may be a skill set quite different than mastering trans limits. So if those limits does not suit your liking, then perhaps non-trans WOE is not for you.

if you want to be greedy and get non-trans castles as well as trans castles, then you should probably know that getting and holding 2 castles in one WOE (be them trans or non trans) is harder than getting and holding 1 castle because you'll have to allocate teams to attack and defend properly. The rewards, it seems to me, appropriately warrant that extra bit of effort... So why should trans and non-trans castles be treated any differently in that respect?
Furthermore, BS (with the help of their alliance, of course) was able at one point in time (or maybe more i don't know) hold one trans and one non-trans castle. Did they not spread their personnel and equips to achieve that?

So if you think they're getting easy eco, then those of you who are "experienced" and/or "well-equipped" should team up and gang BS... but don't complain and say "meh the eco or action is not worth it for me"...

Thus i understand the notion that the excuse "non-trans retro WOE is there for newer guilds" seems far-fetched. However, it does not mean that non-trans WOE beats the purpose of WOE itself (which, last i checked, was to determine who is the better guild -better people, better gear, better strategy, better supplies, etc.). So (after reading the paragraph i gave Bold up there) perhaps you should consider non-trans WOE as a "different" challenge which requires a different approach. The server is giving you a whole different challenge to rise up to, and it's your own fault for not answering that call...

In the end it's up to you. If you deem yourselves worthy of a castle (or vice versa), then have at it. But if you deem non-trans is not worth your time and effort, then don't dis people who actually take the time and effort to guard alde...


-w-

[Astroboi]

The whole point to me is not "BS has it easy" but rather that Alde castle doesn't interest nearly enough people to be worth keeping the way it is. You shouldn't be supposed to push people to go Alde agaisnt their will to create some action. It should come naturally. It obviously doesn't, it never did and it never will; the WoE active population on heRO is already low (obviously isnt a WoE-oriented server) and on top of that you ask them to pick between two options, one being a lot more enjoyable and rewarding than the other.

It's down to:

1- leave non-trans-WoE as is. (Makes little sense, It's sad but, as good as it was, the original idea failed. It didn't catch the population's interest. What happens when a company releases a promotional product and it fails? It's discontinued.)

2- Close non-trans WoE.

3- Change/add a feature about it to attract players. The best idea so far that has been suggested by many is moving it to another day. (this gets my +1).