found a bypass to AFK LEECH limit

[Namine]

thecursed Wrote:

Namine Wrote:Circe can I just activate the final rule now? Trowa's damaging my playing experience cause he's killing my brain cells.

Should we have a hourly schedule and 15 min warning before every bot check then to make sure that your rights to play in heRO without interruption is not violated for the sake of petty matters such as a bot check?

First of all, Ouch. That was mean Namnam
And i never said anything ridiculous like that.

If you aren't worried or annoyed at violation of your rights to play without "petty" interruptions, what's all this thread's fuss about regarding adding a new clause in the rulebook about potential disruption due to botcheck?

If it doesn't bother you, just comply, answer the botcheck, get your free GB out of it (heard that's the new trend though all I got is 10 bats chasing me in the field whose name is "lololololol". You even get a free GB for doing things you ought to be doing. Circe is so soft ), move on with whatever you are doing.

Those who aren't guilty, need not to worry about botchecks- ever. (plus, sometimes you get a free buff out of it: what can possibly go wrong?)

[Former-GM-Circe]

Namine Wrote:You even get a free GB for doing things you ought to be doing. Circe is so soft

Because when you've caught 4 bots in the first 6 checks, and 6 bots once up to 10 checks, you are extremely happy to find someone who is not a bot, and shower them with all the love you possess.
And all the love I possess is a single GB worth.

[thecursed]

GM-Circe Wrote:

Namine Wrote:You even get a free GB for doing things you ought to be doing. Circe is so soft

Because when you've caught 4 bots in the first 6 checks, and 6 bots once up to 10 checks, you are extremely happy to find someone who is not a bot, and shower them with all the love you possess.
And all the love I possess is a single GB worth.

You must be a cruel heartless monster if all the love you possess is worth a single GB...

[Namine]

Hey she can always lock you up in Hugel general store.

But she didn't. Though she should.


So really, Circe's a saint~

[thecursed]

Namine Wrote:Hey she can always lock you up in Hugel general store.

But she didn't. Though she should.


So really, Circe's a saint~

Oh memories...

How about the time you locked me in the morroc house with sword guardians?
Or the time you spawned 3 beezlebubs on me before the dungeon was released?
Or the time you nuked me, wait that happened a few hundred times...
Or that time you jailed me with Wilson the bucket...
Or the time you spawned giant ambernites around me and nuked me?

I miss GM-Ayu made me feel special before she started cheating on me and nuking OTHER people...*shakes fist at Tom*

But obviously the best memory we had together was:
http://pandoraonline.net/forum/showthread.php?tid=5927
You have no idea how much i had to dig for that.

[Zaratus]

So uh. If I understand it right it is legal to

sit in a dungeon and being leeched and moving once in 3 minutes to remove the afk-no-exp-thing

but not allowed to

autofollow with a clown in a dungeon and coming back once in 3 minutes

Am I the only one who sees something weird in that?

What about standing in a dungeon and using bragi and coming back once in 3 minutes to refresh it? Is that bannable too because you're botting (aka having bragi on)? Like you are the clown and have to go afk for a minute and turn bragi on so the party won't die?

Or does this

Circe Wrote:Relevent = getting items or exp, as well as killing or buffing. Both of which you are doing while autofollowing someone else in your party.
Relevent = playing the game. (Sitting and not moving is not playing in this sense. This means using game functions. Moving. Killing. Skills. Buffing, etc. Things that are means to an end.
Bots over 90% are technically not killing things or using skills, either.

mean that all that mentioned above isn't legal? Then I guess you have to ban a few more players. At least 50 % of hero I bet.

Namine Wrote:Should we have a hourly schedule and 15 min warning before every bot check then to make sure that your rights to play in heRO without interruption is not violated for the sake of petty matters such as a bot check?

Yes please.

Edit:
Corp made me think about something different too.
Assuming I am doing a party and I have to go afk because of whatever and I move to the side and sit down and go afk.
First option: Party moves on and kills stuff. Am I being banned then (in the first three minutes)?
Second option: Party stops with me, but a mob spawns on them, they have to kill it or get wiped. Am I being banned then (while I still get exp)?

Am I never allowed to go afk during a party because of that? Do I have to leave the party each time I go afk so I don't gain exp anymore?

This is becoming more and more hilarious the more I think about it.

[Frogboy]

well here's my two cents about "lawyers" (disclaimer: the term lawyers in this case defines anyone who is an actual lawyer or anyone who has taken at least one law class)

these people are way too analytical. because of lawyers no one has any common sense anymore. common sense is a far better judge than a bazillion rules and addendums that lawmakers put in to effect. it puts people on edge about everything, whether they're doing the right thing or potentially breaking the law.

my PoV is this - if you have to find a way around a rule, then you've already broken the rule and need an excuse to cover up your tracks and not be guilty of a crime. this works both in real life, and in this virtual one. my personal opinion, there's too many rules here that have had to come about because people were looking for ways to break rules without getting in trouble.

i will say that there are times when new rules need to be added, but it gets to a point that when people start nitpicking about every little thing that they need to just use the brain they were given. it isn't rocket science to figure out if it's right or wrong. if you think it might be wrong, it probably is, and if you want confirmation on that, then ask someone in charge about it.


ok, now that i've said my *two cents* (more like 50 cents lol) worth on that, regarding using auto-follow, again if you think it might be against the rules, then best not to do it, or at least ask about it with someone in authority. if you really gotta find ways to cheat to play the game, then why are you playing it?

cheating isn't fun, because once you've cheated enough you'll hit your goal and then you'll be just as bored again. you don't prosper, as it just makes you hate doing what you're doing all the more.

[Former-GM-Circe]

Zaratus Wrote:So uh. If I understand it right it is legal to

sit in a dungeon and being leeched and moving once in 3 minutes to remove the afk-no-exp-thing

but not allowed to

autofollow with a clown in a dungeon and coming back once in 3 minutes

Am I the only one who sees something weird in that?

What about standing in a dungeon and using bragi and coming back once in 3 minutes to refresh it? Is that bannable too because you're botting (aka having bragi on)? Like you are the clown and have to go afk for a minute and turn bragi on so the party won't die?

I'm not certain how long other GMs wait, but when I botcheck, I will give them a minute or two to respond. People sometimes are talking in party/guild chat, or alt+tabbed quickly on MSN or some other such.

Like the example that for AFKmists, we must have tested them for a few minutes. Must. Jumping in and going "You didn't respond in 2 seconds. Banned" does not work.

How many people do you see complaining they got banned because they replied shortly after, rather than directly after a GM appeared?

Zaratus Wrote:Or does this

Circe Wrote:Relevent = getting items or exp, as well as killing or buffing. Both of which you are doing while autofollowing someone else in your party.
Relevent = playing the game. (Sitting and not moving is not playing in this sense. This means using game functions. Moving. Killing. Skills. Buffing, etc. Things that are means to an end.
Bots over 90% are technically not killing things or using skills, either.

mean that all that mentioned above isn't legal? Then I guess you have to ban a few more players. At least 50 % of hero I bet.

No. What I said is if you are doing the following, IE, signs of your character being active, and we botcheck you, and you fail... You're banned for failing a botcheck.

Not if you play the game in any way, it is illegal.
Completely uncertain as to how you came to that conclusion.

Zaratus Wrote:

Namine Wrote:Should we have a hourly schedule and 15 min warning before every bot check then to make sure that your rights to play in heRO without interruption is not violated for the sake of petty matters such as a bot check?

Yes please.

We'd better do it via named broadcast, too. So every bot out there that is set to log off when they see a GM or a GM talks has time to get away safely, if they forgot which hour the GMs are coming by.
[/sarcasm]

Zaratus Wrote:Edit:
Corp made me think about something different too.
Assuming I am doing a party and I have to go afk because of whatever and I move to the side and sit down and go afk.
First option: Party moves on and kills stuff. Am I being banned then (in the first three minutes)?
Second option: Party stops with me, but a mob spawns on them, they have to kill it or get wiped. Am I being banned then (while I still get exp)?

Am I never allowed to go afk during a party because of that? Do I have to leave the party each time I go afk so I don't gain exp anymore?

This is becoming more and more hilarious the more I think about it.

First option: See up at the first point on time.
If we were that worried you were AFK leeching (while sitting, and potentially timing out, none the less), then we'd probably check with the rest of the party. In that case, see below.

Second Option: If we check the while party, if they have any want of you potentially not being banned, they'll point out you are AFK. I'll wait for you to come back, and check.
In that time, I'll check IPs to see if it matches another party member, and if so, add dual clienting checks on, to counter the possibility of the AFK guy really being a dualing player who is claiming the other player is AFK while they are passing bot checks on the first.



So. It comes to the question.
Do we 1) Ban everyone, or 2) Let every single bot run free, as apparently, according to you lot, it must be one or the other, as all in between areas are unfair?




No, we're not doing either of the above.


We're really not as evil and out to get you all as so many of you seem to think.

As Frogboy said, use your common sense. If you are unsure, ask.

[Zaratus]

I am aware that that what I wrote wasn't full of common sense but that wasn't my intention at all.

It was just the stuff that came to my mind what COULD happen. Mostly because of the stuff you and Nami mentioned way earlier.

[Psithief]

Right, so the lesson we've learnt through all of this?

Don't use auto-follow, even if you're just following someone so you can see them when you get back from the toilet,
even if you're not partied.
It's too dangerous! You can get banned! Apparently GMs don't look for motive when doing bot-checks, just anything that moves and does not respond.