Reset Cost Question?

[azurerogue]

Warning: This thread ended up being a LOT longer than I meant it to be. If you'd rather get a summary, skip to the bold "End Note" at the bottom of this post.

In the thread it says that the reset cost for 95+ characters is:

GM-Pandora Wrote:Level 95 and above have a base cost + an additional cost depending on the number of time a person has resetted at 95+ since the update of the resetter.

I put the bold-face in there.??Anyways, in game the Resetter implies that he will reset his count on how many times you've reset at 95+ every so often...??does this ever happen???If so, how often?

It hadn't really concerned me before, until recently re-reading the actual thread.??I've generally argued in support of reset cost + items because I don't think people should be switching builds left and right, but for some classes it is totally understandable to reset once every month or two (generally, I mean brewers - alchemists and sinxs...but we all want some variety now and then).??Now, I admit that we (meaning creators and sinxs) could all just make slave brewing characters, but it's supposed to be one of the perks of having a resetter that it would be cheaper to reset than to make a whole new character.??Or, at least, that's how I always saw it.??

Even if it cost me 2-4 million per full reset back and forth to brew, I could see this as totally reasonable.??I understand that having a resetter is not a standard in pay-to-play RO and so it is a nice feature.??What isn't a nice feature is that, unless I feel like making a brewing slave (which I will do if the reset npc never resets his memory, or doesn't do it very often), I'm looking at paying a BASE of 36 million to reset to and from brewing build once per month (which I think is reasonable, since I don't plan to farm more than 5k ad materials per month, though I suppose I could).??

So, so far we're at 36 million zeny per year just to brew.??Quite honestly, that's not really that bad.??I could make that just playing casually.??Now let's look at the additional costs.??24 additional "N" reset costs (assuming I've never ever reset this character at 95+ before), two each month, adds an additional 30 million zeny into the equation.??24 torn scrolls (let's assume I find them for 50k each) is another 1.2 million zeny.??And 24 resets without resetting before would also take 290 Worn-Out Magic Scrolls (not really hard to come by now that Baba-Yaga's drop them in Moscovia, but let's value them at 20k each?).??So that's another 5.8 million.??Then there's the pet egg issue (since I'm a Creator, not an alchemist).??I don't have a full list of accepted pet eggs, but let's assume they're going to run me a minimum of 50k each (I think that's fairly optimistic).??Another 1.2 million zeny down the drain.??

This means that, without ever having reset before, brewing pots and materials for one year costs... *drum roll*

+36 million (base cost)
+30 million ("N" increase cost)
+1.2 million (Torn Scroll estimate)
+5.8 million (Worn-Out Magic Scroll Estimate)
+1.2 million (Egg estimate)
-----------------------
74.2 million total

Dear gods, that's absurd.??*IF* I played every single day of the year, I would need to make an average of about 200k zeny per day just to afford my reset costs...??wtf?!??Now, 200k zeny per day isn't bad...not bad at all, really.??But that doesn't include zeny for equips, gear, warping, saving, healing, buying materials to brew, etc etc etc...??

Now, clearly, I'm not taking this to ridiculous extremes yet.??So let's do that now, eh???

Let's look at it as if the resetter never resets his memory...and let's skip forward a few years (ridiculous, I know, because by then I'd have three transed brew slaves just to prove a point).??I'm resetting for my 191st through 215th times for this coming year (congrats, heRO, on surviving for almost nine years from now - you're getting really old).

+36 million (base cost)
+960 million ("N" increase cost)
+1.2 million (Torn Scroll estimate)
+9.6 million (Worn-Out Magic Scroll estimate)
+1.2 million (Egg estimate)
-------------------------
1008 million zeny total (that's over 1 billion, for those who prefer it that way).

So, if the resetter never...erm, resets himself, and if heRO survives for some time, and if I do not make a brew slave (I've basically just convinced myself that I will)...??I can look forward to...what???A gradually increasing cost per year from around 74.2 million per year to over 1 billion zeny per year just to be able to make things that allow my class to, well, do stuff???Almost every alchemist skill has an item requisite cost.??I need those items.??

Also, for reference, that final cost (after 190 resets and beyond) would require me to be making almost 3 million zeny per day in profit to be able to afford to reset.??MVP cards, I need you! *crosses fingers*

END NOTE: Scaling reset prices are, in the long run, totally ridiculous and only encourage duplicate characters simply because resets are unaffordable.??This is neither an appropriate way to discourage frequent resetting (just put a time limit on resets if you REALLY want to stop us, or a cap on resets, or a level limit, or SOMETHING else), nor is it a way to increase the quality of the game.??All the scaled system does is force me to play through leveling an alchemist again and relive a large series of not-so-enjoyable experiences just to save zeny.??

I acknowledge that this system has worked so far, but if we're going to have a resetter...then let us use it instead of forcing anyone who ultimately wants/needs to change builds occasionally to just say "screw it" and make a second character of the exact same class to meet their needs.??

Sorry for the long rant, work is slow today.

[Aaronock]

LOL Albus, damn you wrote a long rant. Anyway, I actually read all that junk, and scaled resetter at 95+ is crap, I don't see why we just didn't up the price a ton for those characters or whatever. I have heard people saying they will stay 94 trans forever if they can simply to avoid the reset curve at 95+...a bit ridiculous yah?

Meh, I guess I am also complaining cause I haveta make a second sage just to have a FS prof. Maybe another way to do this would be to make reset coupons similar to hatter ones and hair ones? Get them from special events and whatnot, that could be a nice thing to have I would think

[Général_Argos]

Reset are not meant to be done everyweek. This isn't an high rate.

[Rika]

But his complaint??specifically points towards the fact the numbers are based on resetting once a month

I think it's a legit complaint for some classes, thankfully I play classes that don't need constant resets.

[Général_Argos]

It's not a legit problem, it's a legit complain, nothing more.??

I, myself have a blacksmith. I either play him in battle mode or in forge/selling mode. I don't see why I should have it as easy as someone else who would take the time to make two blacksmiths.

[Rika]

I concede to "complaint" rather than "problem" xD That was my original intent and I messed up on that wording completely.

But I do believe other solutions are there that isn't scaling.

[azurerogue]

Blacksmiths have it way easier anyways, Krim. You don't NEED to forge to use class skills.

Alchemists/Creators, on the other hand, need potions to use potion pitcher, condensed potions to use slim potion pitcher, fire bottles and acid bottles to use their primary and secondary attack skills, glistening coats to use chemical protections, etc. We need to brew and, given heRO's size, the option of simply buying pre-brewed materials from players who have made pure brewers (like you can do on a larger server) is not available. As such, I think that it is a legitimate problem (not just a complaint) for brewing classes who NEED to brew items to use skills. If we had a large enough population/economy that I could just find a pure brewer and buy acid bottles and fire bottles from them, it wouldn't be a problem. But the nature of a server heRO's size is that you either have to a) reset or b) make your own slave brewer in order to do this.

Yes, Krim, I am aware I could just make a slave brewer, and I intend to do so. I'm merely pointing out that, if the intended effect of changing the resetter was to limit the amount of resets, it is achieving that and much more in a way that I feel is totally ineffective and off-point. We're not a high rate, but we also don't have the market to accomodate not having a personal brewer / option to reasonably reset to brew build.

[Général_Argos]

azurerogue Wrote:Blacksmiths have it way easier anyways, Krim.??You don't NEED to forge to use class skills.??

Alchemists/Creators, on the other hand, need potions to use potion pitcher, condensed potions to use slim potion pitcher, fire bottles and acid bottles to use their primary and secondary attack skills, glistening coats to use chemical protections, etc.??We need to brew and, given heRO's size, the option of simply buying pre-brewed materials from players who have made pure brewers (like you can do on a larger server) is not available.??As such, I think that it is a legitimate problem (not just a complaint) for brewing classes who NEED to brew items to use skills.??If we had a large enough population/economy that I could just find a pure brewer and buy acid bottles and fire bottles from them, it wouldn't be a problem.??But the nature of a server heRO's size is that you either have to a) reset or b) make your own slave brewer in order to do this.??

So basicly, what you say, is that the problem is for creators uh? So you want resets to be cheaper because life is hard for them? Nobody needs to make a personal brewer. However, every guild needs to make one guild brewer. Think of it as a guild task. I'm sure every guild with 5+ trans people can manage to make a dedicated creator for brewing.

[Kaoreii]

The problem with making "guild" brewers is, like it or not, guilds fall apart. Then who gets control of the brewer?

"Well I spent all my free time leveling it, it's mine"
"Well I spent all my money for brewing gear, it's mine"
"it was my idea, so it's mine."

Ect...

Plus, as has happened with Angel Empire in the past, twice actually...someone with the account info is going to do something stupid and get it banned. then you're brewerless, out all the time and zeny, and back at square 1.

[Général_Argos]

K, so lets bring personnal/guild problems to justify an argument?

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